I've come to the realization that I am already missing HD recording opportunities. Let me explain. When Comcast first started to provide HD signals, the only HD channels they had that I was interested in were the OTA channels, all of which are transmitted "in the clear". I did a brief check yesterday and I've discovered that they have subsequently added several HD channels that I would like to record, but which are not transmitted in the clear. This includes USA and a few other channels. So the fundamental issue that I am concerned with is already impacting me. It's staring to look like I will need to migrate to TIVO HD.


TIVO shows can already be archived. "Tivo to go" enables one to copy the recordings to another PC. They are in mpeg2 format and can be converted to mpeg4 using various utilities. You still cannot stream directly from the TIVO box.


Yes, I understand it is not actually free. I guess it would be more accurate to say that the cost of the first box is "bundled" into the service fees, but this is not the main point. The main point is that they are providing a "bridge" for those who want to continue to use their TVs that only have analog tuners. The US government is also going to subsidize the purchase of boxes that perform a similar function for OTA reception. This is probably a reasonable thing for them to do given the amount of revenue the government will generate auctioning off the spectrum that is being freed up.

Marc

Pardon my rant over the Comcast BS. Actually, my main point.. your current comcast box puts out a signal (channel 3 or 4) to your analog TV.. and so does my "digital comcast box". I don't see Comcast coming after us with a new box that doesn't continue to support this. .. and current channels tagged as "HD" will play normally on my "old school" TV.

I agree that this approach will give me the ability to create a good SD recording. Unfortunately, it won't enable me to create an HD recording. My TV is a 50" Samsung DLP -- the image quality and color saturation with HD recordings is way better than with SD recordings.

I'd love to have a solution that didn't force me down the TIVO path, but I'm not seeing anything obvious.

Marc

HD programming aside, does anyone know if the cable companies (I'm with BrightHouse in Michigan) will be expanding their QAM offerings to include what we currently get via our Basic or Extended Basic subscriptions? I haven't done much searching on the subject myself, and the searching I did turned up nothing conclusive, so if someone can point me to definitive sources I would appreciate it.

We are currently very happy with our KM configuration, if all I have to do is replace the PVR-150 and 350 with clear-QAM tuners to maintain what we get now that would suffice (All our tuners are in the backend in the basement, a digital cable STB would not be practical).

Marc - Everything I have read indicates that subscription HDTV recording is currently not possible without a unit such as TiVO, as you have already noted. I admit to not being well versed in the "bleeding-edge" technology of capture cards though, so perhaps someone is working on/has a card that has the appropriate cable certifications? Doubtful, as I expect I would have read about such a critter on these forums, but I'm hopeful.

Scott

I can't give you a definitive answer, but I can tell you what I see with my current comcast signal. Comcast transmits all the basic and extended basic channels in both analog and digital format. The digital signal is at what one would consider a standard definition resolution (504 x 480). Some of these SD digital signals are "in the clear" and can be recorded with any of the digital tuners supported by mythtv. Some of them are protected and cannot be recorded. As a general guideline, the channels that originated from OTA transmissions are "in the clear"; channels that are cable-only like lifetime, USA, etc., are protected.

Marc

Yep, that's what I have found during my limited searching. I'll keep hunting (and for now hoping that a viable alternative to TivO comes along)

Thanks for the reply Marc.

The lack of a viable alternative to Commercial Products like Tivo or their own branded DVR's and not allowing the user direct access to a captureable signal seems to point to the heart of the issue.

There seem to be a couple of things going on in the industry.
1) Miscommunication or possibly even misrepresentation - there is mass confusion regarding what the "end of analog TV" or the Digital only date really means. Most vendors of TV equipment are going to tell you it is all analog, standard definition signals that will end in 2009. Of course this directly relates to them being able to "Sell to you" a new TV set. Which goes right to their bottom line.

2) Industry didn't succesfully win with the Broadcast flag thing and they make money by getting you to watch all the program they send through the pipe, not just the primary content. First way to control that is only provide access through industry controlled boxes. I mean what benefit is it to the Cable/Satellite etc provider to allow you to run something like a Mythbox in lieu of their commercially accountable paid for DVR service?

While it is only a handful of their customers in comparison, it still has the potential to affect their bottom line, and even has the potential to provide a buisness market to other providers (Tivo competitors)

I don't mean to digress or sound too negative here, those who are in a city and have digital transmissions will be served at least for the Local Content. it is the other 90% of the country in land mass that loses out. We can only get what the cable or more likely Satelitte providers will feed us. And since our SD sets are aging, most likely we will have to pay extra to be able to have content captured on our new HD TV's.

Anyway, I really hope someone will come up with a reasonably priced viable alternative for all. It isn't like we want to priat e it, I just prefer to watch like a season of 24 in one fell swoop than try to get myself in front of the TV each week for 24 weeks.

bigbro, from your post it sounds like you're not concerned with having a hidef signal -- that you would be satisfied with a SD recording. If this is the case than you won't have any problems -- you can simply use an external digital tuner and record off of that.

Marc

I would love to have a Hi Def signal, but at this time it is not available to me unless I buy one of their proprietary devices and pay a monthly fee, not worth that much to me and I value my privacy in the choices I make in programming.

My only signal choice is Satellite. If I could get OTA I would that, but nearest source is 120 miles through the mountains, and there is no cable - 9 miles away.

So I am researching if there are any ways to reasonably get an HD signal in that situation.

Official Details on the Transition from analog to digital TV signal in the US.
http://www.dtvtransition.org/

Note on the "howto" page:

Of course, if comcast stops sending an analog signal, you'll have to get a digital box from them, which will convert the digital signal to your analog gear.

I think we're all aware of that. The problem is the new digital signal that comcast is already rolling out (there's no "if" here) cannot be easily recorded by MythTV with the exception of clear broadcast channels.

Generally all the providers, not just Comcast, are providing very little (worth recording) other than OTA channels in the clear (unencrypted QAM). Which means I have very little reason to keep Comcast when/if they drop analog.

They say they encrypt channels because the content providers insist on it, (which is pretty much the case) Of course, they don't fight this and they opportunistically approve because they believe that the encryption drives people to upgrade their accounts to include multiple digital STB's and PVR's. Cha-Ching!!! So far they've been given no reason to believe their logic is bad.

Unless LARGE numbers of people say they will drop cable without recordable channels, (and follow through) Comcast has no reason to press providers to allow clear transmission. On the other hand If they start losing business they'll do what it takes to protect it. Imagine if Comcast, TimeWarner, and Verizon all went upstream saying "Were dropping you from our lineups unless we can transmit in the clear."

Sadly, it will happen ONLY in our imaginations. There simply aren't any recording devices not already owned by Comcast, et. al. except for Myth and Tivo. The number of users of third-party (or open) recording devices has dropped to the vanishing point.

Tivo is likely to be out of business before long, because they have been dropped by DirecTV completely and Comcast never really promoted the Tivo product.

Maybe people will long for their VCRs, but they'll be gone too. I have a pretty bleak view of the home entertainment future...

-- Joe

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I share that view, and its really sad.

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I'd like to think that you're wrong on this.. but we have to be realistic. It's hard to understand why Tivo isn't aggressively going after partnerships with the cable and satellite companies. Not many companies are also a "verb".. (uhhhh, let's see... there's "google". ) A friend of mine has multiple Tivo boxes.. for his sake, I hope that Tivo makes the cut!
Since it's a public company, we can watch this company grow/crash... http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=TIVO .. hmmm, P/E (ttm): n/a. That's not good!
"January 31, 2008, 1:32 pm - TiVo Shares Jump; Court Says DISH Infringed Patents" .. There is always "profit through litigation".
There's also the "slingbox" by Sling Media (privately held) http://www.slingmedia.com/ .. This is a pretty sexy product that should also be impacted by closed media distribution. (no reason why mythtv can't do this function as well!) (hmmm. Jim Cramer's Mad Money on my iTouch.. I guess I'll have to buy one of those first! )